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 what am I missing? 


Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 22
Location: oz
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two opposing units of short bow B facing off against each other.
both S, 2=vbu, i=0
can't shoot at each other.
vbu =2, - 2 shooting at S, -1 shooting at close range -1 dice.
so -1 dice shooting

then they cant charge each other as they are both without "I" so they were stuck facing each other 1 cm appart.
what did we miss?

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Joined: 01 Oct 2007
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in Basic Impetus S have a defensive role. So they tend to nullify each others.
This means that it is time for heavy troops to fight.
So
1) use them to disorder your opponent's line
2) use them to avoid your opponent makes the same

Contrary to other rule sets (where they can decide a melee), S are not those light elite force whoose role is to occupy a tactical position (like moden paras for example) and fight for it, but simply troops who their main role is to screen/support the main battle line.

They tend to retire/evade when things go bad, more than sacrifice themselves. I wanted to avoid a deadly duel (if you make a cohesion test with a S, means you are dead at 90%).

In Impetus you have some more options. But here they can evade etc
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Joined: 12 May 2008
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Location: oz
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Ok but it looks strange with two unit's sitting 1 cm appart not being able to hurt each other or at least have the option of trying to chase the other away.

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Joined: 12 Apr 2008
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Remember these are free rules to demonstrate the base mechanics found in IMPETUS rather that a complete gaming system in themselves - upgrade to IMPETUS full and all your worries will be over. In BI the use of skirmishers is a quick shield which will slow you down, in the full version they work very well indeed.
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in BI you have very few S, usually 1 or 2. This mean that a single lucky throw can put away all you S. BI cannot "shade" many things, like full Impetus can.

The fact that 2 S units are not able to hurt each other is not so strange. For example in the War of the Roses, with the exception of Towton, longobowmen duels (and almost all battles of the WOR started with a longbowmen duel) have never been successful. It were always the bilmen+maa lines to decide the battle. WOR longbowmen were formed archers and provided a "solid" target each other!! But they tend not to suicide.
Also at Towton where one side prevailed over the other, the loosing side retired, leaving space to the armoured guys.

S are more a dispersed troop and the aimed fire is not so easy.

Once you have realized that they are useless to destroy other S, you will use them in a different way.
For example you will use them to cover your troops less afraid to loose them in a duel. Even if they cannot (actually there are exceptions if you play the Renaissance) destroy other S, they will be very usefull to avoid enemy S can disorder your line.
S are a very useful troop!!
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Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 22
Location: oz
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Rich J wrote:
Remember these are free rules to demonstrate the base mechanics found in IMPETUS rather that a complete gaming system in themselves - upgrade to IMPETUS full and all your worries will be over. In BI the use of skirmishers is a quick shield which will slow you down, in the full version they work very well indeed.


No it's fine, (free or not they should still work correctly) at the time it just looked odd and we thought we had missed something. If that's what was intended we can live with it, no worries.

I do have BI on order (how long does it take to get to oz?).
Cheers Slacky


Last edited by slack jawed idiot on Sat May 24, 2008 1:52 am; edited 1 time in total

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I confirm you that this is not a bug, but a choice, and for this reason it will remain the same in the upcoming updated version.
Probably could be considered an abstraction but it is intended to get a best game as a whole. Simply you have to reconsider the use of S.

I see for example that many ex-DBx players tend to use their FL and S into the terrain. While you can use them into the terrain, this should not be their main task.

In BI (and in Impetus with more options) you have to use to screen your main battle line. If both side have correctly screened their battle line it is a question of coordination between you FP (or other heavy troops) and your S. You need to screen your line but at the same time avoid the useless sacrifice of your S.

Simply I wanted to focussed the use of S in this role (an important one, in my opinion).
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I do have BI on order (how long does it take to get to oz?),


Slacky, when and from who did you order the rule book?
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Joined: 12 May 2008
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Location: oz
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No it's fine, different rules and all that, as I said we weren't sure we were missing something, if anything.
Apart from the "is that right?"moment it's been fun so far. Oh and the indestructable Ottoman cinc that wouldn't die let alone take a casualty after 8 combats Shocked Shocked Very Happy

Cheers Slacky

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